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      "author": "steemitboard",
      "permlink": "steemitboard-notify-castorlib-20191215t082627000z",
      "title": "",
      "body": "Congratulations @castorlib! You received a personal award!\n\n<table><tr><td>https://steemitimages.com/70x70/http://steemitboard.com/@castorlib/birthday3.png</td><td>Happy Birthday! - You are on the Steem blockchain for 3 years!</td></tr></table>\n\n<sub>_You can view [your badges on your Steem Board](https://steemitboard.com/@castorlib) and compare to others on the [Steem Ranking](https://steemitboard.com/ranking/index.php?name=castorlib)_</sub>\n\n\n###### [Vote for @Steemitboard as a witness](https://v2.steemconnect.com/sign/account-witness-vote?witness=steemitboard&approve=1) to get one more award and increased upvotes!",
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      "title": "",
      "body": "I am curios about what things are at the top of your \"things we have broken\" list, and what you are doing about them?",
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      "author": "castorlib",
      "permlink": "working-with-ice-and-ethical-dilemmas",
      "title": "Working with ICE and Ethical Dilemmas",
      "body": "http://www.thebluediamondgallery.com/typewriter/images/ethical-dilemma.jpg\n\nIf you are in the right technological circles, you probably have heard about the current situation with the tech company Chef and their ICE contract. During the past few days I saw hints of what was brewing, but it was the CTO’s response that got my brain going on this one.\n\nIn [his post](https://blog.chef.io/2019/09/20/a-personal-message-from-the-cto/), he claims both that “It’s been impossibly hard for me to decide how to approach talking directly about something as vile as kids being torn away from their parents” and that “Chef’s software deal with ICE is not structured or intended by any means to enable any of the abhorrent behavior this community has been concerned about”.\n\nI personally, find this stance confusing. I am obviously not aware of the details of the contract, but with the knowledge I have about Chef’s technology, I find it hard to believe that it can be true. Does the contract automate and monitor the infrastructure that aids in operations that are not related to detaining and processing detainees?\n\nMaybe the CTO believes that ICE is evil and this is the rationalization that he has created to be able to continue to work on a project that he finds immoral; or, he disapproves of some things, but does not necessarily think that ICE’s mission is evil; or he actually agrees with ICE’s mission and he is simply lying to try and stop the backlash.\n\nWell, I don’t find this speculating that interesting, so lets say we take him at his word: He thinks ICE does VILE things, but he also believes that his work is not INTENDED to ENABLE those vile things.\n\nI think this is the crux of the situation: How close is too close to evil?\n\nSome people might argue that the answer is simple: Just don’t work with evil. I might argue that evil is not a binary, but a spectrum. Regardless, the equation is probably not that complicated: The more evil one thing is, the furthest away you should be from it.\n\nThe problem with that equation is that it does not ring true to me. Do we really need to stay away from evil? Should one never engage with “evil” ideas, people, organizations, etc?\n\nHopefully at this point you are realizing that I am trying to burn my own straw man.  The question is not about general proximity to VILE/EVIL things, but about the proximity to ENABLING those things.\n\nWhat is the answer? How close is too close? I believe that one needs to be a person of extreme moral fortitude when playing in some of this ethical muddy waters, because I do not believe the answers are easy.\n\nLets walk through an example. Lets say that we are prison guards, in a prison in which the conditions are bad enough that some of the inmates inevitably will die. Maybe we started before knowing that inmates where dying, but now that we know, what should we do? By helping keep the inmates in the jail, we are definitely aiding/enabling the death of some of them. In the realm of evil there might be muddy waters, but most of us can probably agree that most systems that are actively causing the death of others are not good ones. So, maybe, the answer is simple. We will quit our job. Well, maybe it is not that simple. We are not one of those guards that are here just for a job, we became prison guards because we believe that a majority of the inmates in this jail are causing great harm to society. So, maybe the question is: How many lives is the jail taking compared to the number of lives it is saving?\nAnd just like that, we started doing the math on what a life is worth compared to others. We are just prison guards, and even though we know someone somewhere must be playing God, we are not doing that. So, we quit! But, if we quit, the positions will just be filled by others, the conditions will not change, and people will die anyways. So, am I doing a good thing? \n\nI am sure I could continue down many rabbit holes in this example, but hopefully I made my point. It being that these ethical conundrums are not easily solved, because most of the times the situations do not fall in a place where it is painfully obvious what should be done.\n\nSo, should Chef be working with ICE? I really don’t know.\n\nI have become too cynical. I do not watch the news because I do not believe I can trust anything it is reported without it being tainted. So, I am mostly unaware of the details of what is happening on the border with ICE, except for the headlines, and other things I have heard in passing. In short, I do not know enough.\n\nAs I say that, it almost feels like an excuse. The more pertinent question is, can anyone know enough? Maybe my toy example illustrated that systems and situations are too complex for us to KNOW. \n\nMaybe, after all, the most sensible solutions is what Chef chose: [“I do not believe that it is appropriate, practical, or within our mission to examine specific government projects with the purpose of selecting which U.S. agencies we should or should not do business.”](https://blog.chef.io/2019/09/19/chefs-position-on-customer-engagement-in-the-public-and-private-sectors/).\n\nMaybe we should all continue doing the things that seem innate to us, like building gas chambers in concentration camps, and hoping that at some point the moral dilemma becomes clear enough so those being asked to drop the poison pallets into a chamber full of people have the moral fortitude to say no.",
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      "title": "Working with ICE and Ethical Dilemmas",
      "body": "http://www.thebluediamondgallery.com/typewriter/images/ethical-dilemma.jpg\n\nIf you are in the right technological circles, you probably have heard about the current situation with the tech company Chef and their ICE contract. During the past few days I saw hints of what was brewing, but it was the CTO’s response that got my brain going on this one.\n\nIn [his post](https://blog.chef.io/2019/09/20/a-personal-message-from-the-cto/), he claims both that “It’s been impossibly hard for me to decide how to approach talking directly about something as vile as kids being torn away from their parents” and that “Chef’s software deal with ICE is not structured or intended by any means to enable any of the abhorrent behavior this community has been concerned about”.\n\nI personally, find this stance confusing. I am obviously not aware of the details of the contract, but with the knowledge I have about Chef’s technology, I find it hard to believe that it can be true. Does the contract automate and monitor the infrastructure that aids in operations that are not related to detaining and processing detainees?\n\nMaybe the CTO believes that ICE is evil and this is the rationalization that he has created to be able to continue to work on a project that he finds immoral; or, he disapproves of some things, but does not necessarily think that ICE’s mission is evil; or he actually agrees with ICE’s mission and he is simply lying to try and stop the backlash.\n\nWell, I don’t find this speculating that interesting, so lets say we take him at his word: He thinks ICE does VILE things, but he also believes that his work is not INTENDED to ENABLE those vile things.\n\nI think this is the crux of the situation: How close is too close to evil?\n\nSome people might argue that the answer is simple: Just don’t work with evil. I might argue that evil is not a binary, but a spectrum. Regardless, the equation is probably not that complicated: The more evil one thing is, the furthest away you should be from it.\n\nThe problem with that equation is that it does not ring true to me. Do we really need to stay away from evil? Should one never engage with “evil” ideas, people, organizations, etc?\n\nHopefully at this point you are realizing that I am trying to burn my own straw man.  The question is not about general proximity to VILE/EVIL things, but about the proximity to ENABLING those things.\n\nWhat is the answer? How close is too close? I believe that one needs to be a person of extreme moral fortitude when playing in some of this ethical muddy waters, because I do not believe the answers are easy.\n\nLets walk through an example. Lets say that we are prison guards, in a prison in which the conditions are bad enough that some of the inmates inevitably will die. Maybe we started before knowing that inmates where dying, but now that we know, what should we do? By helping keep the inmates in the jail, we are definitely aiding/enabling the death of some of them. In the realm of evil there might be muddy waters, but most of us can probably agree that most systems that are actively causing the death of others are not good ones. So, maybe, the answer is simple. We will quit our job. Well, maybe it is not that simple. We are not one of those guards that are here just for a job, we became prison guards because we believe that a majority of the inmates in this jail are causing great harm to society. So, maybe the question is: How many lives is the jail taking compared to the number of lives it is saving?\nAnd just like that, we started doing the math on what a life is worth compared to others. We are just prison guards, and even though we know someone somewhere must be playing God, we are not doing that. So, we quit! But, if we quit, the positions will just be filled by others, the conditions will not change, and people will die anyways. So, am I doing a good thing? \n\nI am sure I could continue down many rabbit holes in this example, but hopefully I made my point. It being that these ethical conundrums are not easily solved, because most of the times the situations do not fall in a place where it is painfully obvious what should be done.\n\nSo, should Chef be working with ICE? I really don’t know.\n\nI have become too cynical. I do not watch the news because I do not believe I can trust anything it is reported without it being tainted. So, I am mostly unaware of the details of what is happening on the border with ICE, except for the headlines, and other things I have heard in passing. In short, I do not know enough.\n\nAs I say that, it almost feels like an excuse. The more pertinent question is, can anyone know enough? Maybe my toy example illustrated that systems and situations are too complex for us to KNOW. \n\nMaybe, after all, the most sensible solutions is what Chef chose: [“I do not believe that it is appropriate, practical, or within our mission to examine specific government projects with the purpose of selecting which U.S. agencies we should or should not do business.”](https://blog.chef.io/2019/09/19/chefs-position-on-customer-engagement-in-the-public-and-private-sectors/).\n\nMaybe we should all continue doing the things that seem innate to us, like building gas chambers in concentration camps, and hoping that at some point the moral dilemma becomes clear enough so those being asked to drop the poison pallets into a chamber full of people have the moral fortitude to say no.",
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      "body": "Congratulations @castorlib! You received a personal award!\n\n<table><tr><td>https://steemitimages.com/70x70/http://steemitboard.com/@castorlib/birthday2.png</td><td>2 Years on Steemit</td></tr></table>\n\n<sub>_[Click here to view your Board of Honor](https://steemitboard.com/@castorlib)_</sub>\n\n\n> Support [SteemitBoard's project](https://steemit.com/@steemitboard)! **[Vote for its witness](https://v2.steemconnect.com/sign/account-witness-vote?witness=steemitboard&approve=1)** and **get one more award**!",
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      "body": "What constitutes \"good\" moderation is a whole other topic, and one that I don't have enough expertise to give more than random personal opinions on.  (And my random personal opinions would probably piss off a lot of people.)  My point here is that just because good moderation is hard (true) doesn't mean we can or should avoid it.  Calls for \"no moderation\" are, almost invariably, born of a desire to not be yourself held accountable for your actions, and even if well-meaning lead to community death.\n\nI didn't say that we should ban/shun anyone that does not uphold a particular standard as a first-step.  Sometimes banning people really is the best solution, but it's always better if something else can be done instead.  (Education, mediation, timeout, whatever.)  If those don't work, though, then removing a toxic element is better than trying to mediate between toxicity and everyone else.\n\nThe individuals banned from the PHP Internals list in this case had been sources of trouble for literally years.  Their removal was long overdue.",
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      "body": "The word moderation is perfectly suitable to the spirit of what you are trying to convey, but it speaks more to the outcome than the means. Yes, we want conversations to be focus and fruitful, but moderation does not speak to how. It seems like your solution is to define a standard of behavior and to then ban/shun anyone that does not uphold to that standard.\n\nMy problem with this solution is that it feels too rigid and impersonal. In a community, we get to know the members. We get to understand their personalities. Yes, some of them will be more difficult than others, but we need to allow for the emotional and intellectual range and complexities that, as you pointed, our flawed humanity brings to the table. I am not saying that no one should ever be banned, but what I am saying is that it should be a last resort.\n\nThis is why I like the word mediation better. Mediation speaks to the means of how we reach moderation. We should always strive to resolve conflicts in ways that allow all of the involved parties to become better through the struggle. \n\nVery curios to see what your thoughts are around these ideas, and thank you for writing about this. I agree with the feeling that both the do-nothing and do-something positions seem similarly harmful, so we need to struggle with these conversations repeatedly and often.",
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      "body": "I lost all interest in the community as a result of this whole affair. The Diversity and Inclusion initiative is poorly managed and dominated by ideologues who mistake their efforts for a wider attempt at achieving a more just and equitable society. Overall, the 'leaders' of this effort push rhetoric that falls into narrowly-defined class definitions that elevate preferences to the level of actionable offense. It can't really sustain itself without a constant series of these kinds of encounters, steer clear of them if you can.",
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      "body": "That's precisely what I thought after watching the above Adam Ruins Everything. That's what got me thinking: is there not a better way?\n\nMaybe there is, but I can't think of one. The fact is \"People Like You\" are probably more intelligent than the average population. A cause doesn't need the top 10% to get done. It needs the average 51% of which many care more about what they feel than objective facts.\n\nYes, some climate change and evolution deniers have what seems like a very scientific approach, but that's because they're playing both sides. They want to appeal to you AND the people who react more to emotional appeal. If they have a method to convince someone more intelectual, why wouldn't they?\n\nThis is ultimately what I feel needs to happen too. Of course the hard facts need to be shown, but that doesn't negate the need for mass appeal. While my intelligent friends support climate change on the merits of the evidence, most of the people I know tend to repeat talking points about what we leave to our children. They only speak and listen to the level of their understanding, just as you do when you find a more fact-based argument.\n\nThat all said, I absolutely think we need to all fight the spread of misinformation. I don't condone lying, but I think this method of framing things more emotionally is the only way to get through to the majority of the population.",
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      "parent_author": "johnyliltoe",
      "parent_permlink": "a-plea-to-emotion-why-this-underhanded-tactic-is-necessary",
      "author": "castorlib",
      "permlink": "re-johnyliltoe-a-plea-to-emotion-why-this-underhanded-tactic-is-necessary-20170729t024422600z",
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      "body": "But isn't the appeal to emotion the tactic that has been used this whole time (at least in regards to climate change)? It does not seem to be working. When I think about the major documentaries discussing climate change, they mostly appeal to fear. Yes, they do give you some data, but mostly it is fear. This makes sense, if you think that something catastrophic is about to happen, so I don't blame them for the approach, but the issue with this approach is with people like me.\n\n A few months ago, I heard a talk from a \"climate change\" denier, and he was all about the data. That caught my attention, and I started to watch as many debates on the topic as I could find. In most, if not all, of them, the \"climate change\" denier's side always seemed better informed, more rational, and scientific. This very scientific approach to denial is not unique to climate change. If you watch any talks from the \"intelligent design\" (evolution denial) crowd, you will find that they seem very well informed. The difference is that in the realm of \"intelligent design\" you will find plenty of smart people offering counter arguments. This is not the case with climate change.\n\nSo, I would say that we should drop the emotional appeal, and encourage all of the many, very smart, climate scientist, and other well informed individuals to start fighting misinformation, so others like me that are interested in the truth can find better tools to make sound and rational decisions.",
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      "parent_permlink": "re-dana-edwards-decentralization-is-only-a-means-to-an-end-how-can-we-protect-human-rights-through-technology-moral-amplifiers-20170413t035605100z",
      "author": "dana-edwards",
      "permlink": "re-castorlib-re-dana-edwards-decentralization-is-only-a-means-to-an-end-how-can-we-protect-human-rights-through-technology-moral-amplifiers-20170413t043519770z",
      "title": "",
      "body": ">Let me illustrate with an example. Lets say that I create a content publishing platform for the web, and I share the code. This tool is ethically agnostic. It does not know what kind of content will be published. But, lets say that we care about ethics, so we embed a fact-checking tool with our publishing platform, to help authors publish more accurate information. Well, If anyone wants to use our platform to publish factual inaccuracies, all they have to do is take the fact-checking tool off of the source code. We could decide not to share the source code, but this has all sorts of ethical issues within itself, that is why the free software movement exists.\n\nThe source code isn't where it's important to be ethical. It's in the formal specification which ultimately can become a source code and then executable but it's not the source code. The formal specification is a description of the intended behavior of the publishing platform. In that description of behavior you would be able to make a decision whether to have the capability to moderate the platform or to leave it unmoderateable.  To make it a platform which can be moderated is allowing the ethics of the community to determine which content is visible on the platform, which content becomes popular, which content becomes rewarded, etc. In a completely agnostic platform you would have all kinds of content with no collaborative filtering mechanism and as a result less people will find the sort of information they like and more people will be confronted with information they don't want to be exposed to. So by design you want to give as much control over these decisions to the users, as to what they would like to see, or what they want on the platform, and you could even in the formal specification detail it as a right of the user to filter content according to their preferences whether collectively, individually, or in any human-machine combination.\n\n>The fact that it is hard for us to embed an ethical tool within an agnostic tool does not diminish the value of either, but it does point to the fact that it is, probably, a better use of our resources to simply publish the useful, agnostic tools, and then create tools to fight the improper uses of the agnostic tools once the ill effects materialize.\n\nA formal specification isn't necessarily agnostic because you decide which features to prioritize. So for example if you put in a consensus mechanism then the platform appears agnostic, but what you're really doing is giving the users control over the ethical element of the platform through the consensus mechanism.  You're giving the user the ability to take features out, put features in, change whatever they need to change to make sure the platform stays in an acceptable range of ethical.\n\n > Otherwise we might find our selves spinning our wheels forever trying to safe guard all our tools for improper uses that might never exist. The first option seems more consequentialist to me.\n\nIt's not our tools. The tools belong to the world. The tool maker just has to design the tool to be  capable of learning about the user in such a way that it can be \"ethically aware\" in the sense that it has a model of what a human is, has a model of what the various human religions are, has models of the different philosophical views,  schools of thought, social norms, traditions, laws, etc. This knowledge can allow the platform to help the user to adhere to their own rules because it's aware that humans adhere to these rules. The platform does not make rules for humans, or determine the rules, it simply can reason over it's knowledge which is supplied by humans.\n\nSo just as you can supply Wikipedia with the knowledge of humanity, then maybe a platform can use that knowledge to understand little facts about humanity and when it's time to redesign the platform it can be aware of these little facts and help humans to make better design decisions. For example a platform which is aware of human rights can give suggestions to help make it's formal specification better for those who care about human rights. But how would it know if the users care about human rights? The consensus process would reveal what the users care about which is why consensus is so important.\n\nIf the majority of users of Steemit express support for human rights according to a process defined in the formal specification then once consensus is reached  the platform would know to suggest design improvements according to this priority. That is possible using AI which reasons over a knowledge base.",
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      "body": "@@ -2845,12 +2845,59 @@\n tered_design\n+%0A4. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Mind\n",
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      "author": "dana-edwards",
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      "title": "",
      "body": "@@ -1893,8 +1893,964 @@\n ee with.\n+%0A%0AThe ethics do not go into the source code. In addition, it's not so important that you put your ethics into anything. What you have to do is create a platform which is capable of inheriting the ethics of the community based on some consensus process. This capability can be part of the formal specification of the platform and verified by the formal verification process. The behavior of AI can be constrained in the formal specification and proven by the formal verification process. Platform which don't respect the ethics of the community and which violate human rights can be avoided for alternative platforms which do and the platform most fit will ultimately survive in a truly free market. Of course I know we don't have a truly free market but that is the theory at least.%0A%0AReferences%0A1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_specification%0A2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_verification %0A3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User-centered_design\n",
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      "parent_permlink": "re-dana-edwards-decentralization-is-only-a-means-to-an-end-how-can-we-protect-human-rights-through-technology-moral-amplifiers-20170413t035605100z",
      "author": "dana-edwards",
      "permlink": "re-castorlib-re-dana-edwards-decentralization-is-only-a-means-to-an-end-how-can-we-protect-human-rights-through-technology-moral-amplifiers-20170413t041331129z",
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      "body": "Have you heard of extended mind theory? The idea is that your tool becomes an extension of you, it's a part of your mind. So your ethics embedded into it only is a digital self representation. Agent based AI for example must have a set of goals and priorities and if it's your personal agent then it's going to have your goals, priorities, and ethics. By ethically aware I mean we need a platform which can contain knowledge of human experience, laws, social norms, ethics, in it's knowledge base, with an ability to reason over it, and help people to make higher quality decisions.\n\n>The fact that it is hard for us to embed an ethical tool within an agnostic tool does not diminish the value of either, but it does point to the fact that it is, probably, a better use of our resources to simply publish the useful, agnostic tools, \n\nNot embed ethics in the tool but in the AI itself and in the design. By design I mean the mechanism design which is not the source code but the incentive structure. For example Bitcoin attempted to be decentralized because the mechanism design promotes certain priorities and security guarantees. Of course it failed because it's becoming centralized but you can see how mechanism design works by rewarding the participants on the platform who play the game according to the agreed rules which gives an incentive to adhere to those design constraints. \n\nSteemit has this too with it's reputation system and reward system. It's an information diffusion and generation platform where you're encouraged to share new information on a transparent blockchain. Your property rights in theory are supposed to be protected by your control of the private keys.  So there definitely is ethics built into the design of Steemit and while anyone can fork the code and create a different version the community will typically join the platform which has the ethics they agree with.",
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      "body": "I believe that technology should be used in any way possible to help us understand whatever ethical system we believe to be following, and, as you mentioned, even to help guide us in that journey. But this is not exactly equivalent with \"ethically aware\" technology. I see many issues with trying to embed ethics into all our technical tools, but the most obvious to me is that ultimately, it is up to the person using the tool and not the creator. \n\nLet me illustrate with an example. Lets say that I create a content publishing platform for the web, and I share the code. This tool is ethically agnostic. It does not know what kind of content will be published. But, lets say that we care about ethics, so we embed a fact-checking tool with our publishing platform, to help authors publish more accurate information. Well, If anyone wants to use our platform to publish factual inaccuracies, all they have to do is take the fact-checking tool off of the source code. We could decide not to share the source code, but this has all sorts of ethical issues within itself, that is why the free software movement exists. \n\nThe fact that it is hard for us to embed an ethical tool within an agnostic tool does not diminish the value of either, but it does point to the fact that it is, probably, a better use of our resources to simply publish the useful, agnostic tools, and then create tools to fight the improper uses of the agnostic tools once the ill effects materialize. Otherwise we might find our selves spinning our wheels forever trying to safe guard all our tools for improper uses that might never exist. The first option seems more consequentialist to me.",
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      "body": "@@ -1,20 +1,117 @@\n+!%5BLines Lines%5D(https://cdn.pixabay.com/photo/2014/03/24/13/40/electric-lines-293964_960_720.png)%0A\n This is not a post I\n",
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      "author": "castorlib",
      "permlink": "drawing-lines-at-actions-and-not-thoughts-analysis-of-larry-garfield-s-excommunication-from-the-drupal-community",
      "title": "Drawing Lines at Actions and Not Thoughts: Analysis of Larry Garfield's Excommunication from the Drupal Community",
      "body": "This is not a post I  want to write, but sadly, once again, another person has fallen victim to ideological wars. \n\nRecently, Larry Garfield, a respected and highly influential member of the Drupal [1] community, has been ejected for the crime of being too close to an ideology considered too egregious to be allowed. The short version of the story is that Larry Garfield was discovered to be a member of the [Gorean subculture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gorean_subculture) which is \"based on the principle that women are [evolutionarily] predisposed to serve men and that the natural order is for men to dominate and lead\". That quote came from the article written by Dries Buytaert, Drupal's creator, [explaining Larry's excommunication from the project](http://buytaert.net/living-our-values). It is not clear to me whether the \"natural order between men and women\" is a _belief_ in the Gorean community or simply a scenario in which to play fantasies of domination in the context of sex. But, for the sake of argument, lets assume that this is a deeply rooted philosophical cornerstone for anyone in the Gorean community, including Larry. Is this a good reason to ostracize a productive member of a tech-community, or any community for that matter?\n\nThis is not an easy question, and the responses from the Drupal community have demonstrated it in the immense range of reactions: From total support with the decision to calls for Dries and other members of the leadership to resign.\n\nEven though it is not an easy question, I have reached a personal conclusion, and I would like to share the mental process that got me here.\n\n## The lines should always be drawn at actions and not thoughts\n\nThe first question that came to mind was: Why do we draw lines in the first place? Why do we have laws, constitutions, rules, and codes of conduct? Well, I believe it all depends on what you are trying to accomplish. If the purpose of a governing body is to ensure \"liberty and the pursuit of happiness\" to all its members, it will have different rules than if its purpose is to \"maximize safety\". There are always trade-offs and rules should always be examined through the lens of their purpose.\n\nEven though the purpose of the US government is interpreted in different ways by different people, what is clear is that the constitution rightly protects **freedom of expression**. Why is this important? Well, many times in history we have become enamored with ideas and have \"protected\" them through many means. In many instances, to the point of committing terrible atrocities and to only find later on, through open discussion and investigation, that those ideas were wrong.\n\nBut aren't some ideas too dangerous to be allowed in any form? Yes, I believe that some ideas are more dangerous than others. In the category of most dangerous are those ideas that dehumanize a group. Once dehumanization takes places, it becomes much easier to abuse these groups. So, yes, I do not believe that all ideas are equally harmless, but I also do not believe that censorship helps the eradication of these terrible ideas in any way. As I previously expressed, bad ideas have survived and prospered in the past through propaganda, censorship, murder, etc. Only when better ideas came we were able to overcome. Bad ideas should be expressed openly and without prejudice, so better ideas can replace them, and get solidified through open discussion.\n\nCensorship only pushes the fringe ideas to the edges of society where they will continue to thrive in their echo chambers.\n\nI believe this is a clear cut argument in defense of freedom of expression, but even now I still hear many arguments of this form: \"Yes, the US government protects freedom of expression for US citizens but groups like Drupal are private and they have the right to create their own rules for their own purposes, including restricting expression.\"\n\nI do not disagree with all of that, after all, as I mentioned previously, rules should follow whatever purpose they are trying to accomplish, and the purpose of Drupal is much more specific than the purpose of the US government. According to Drupal's [code of conduct](https://www.drupal.org/dcoc), its purpose is to \"[keep] Drupal a fun, welcoming, challenging, and fair place to play\". Not surprisingly, the rest of the text in the code of conduct supports the idea that as long as ones actions are respectful to other members, everything is ok. But, this decision regarding Larry seem to violate the code of conduct's own guidelines and recommendations. So, we are at an impasse: Does excluding certain members with bad ideas enhances Drupal's purpose as expressed in its code of conduct, or does it diminish it?\n\nYes, it is possible that this \"knowledge\" about Larry will make some people uncomfortable, but whether Drupal is a more or less welcoming community with or without Larry is an open question that can only be answered by examining the individual interactions of people with Larry. But, what is not an open question is whether Drupal will become less welcoming as it continuous to mark certain ideas as UNWELCOMED.\n\nThese are my current thoughts, I would love to hear any counter arguments as I think this is an important issue, and as expressed, the best ideas will only come through the fire of open discussion.\n\n[1] An open-source content managment system written in PHP\n\n### Other Related Resources\n[Sex and Gor and open source](https://techcrunch.com/2017/03/26/sex-and-gor-and-open-source/)\n[TMI About me](https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/tmi-outing)\n[CWG Public Statement - March 23, 2017](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tcwuuip9qAMtGNir7_aD1zhWubEkisNnkG3n7CHFPbM/edit?usp=sharing)",
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